Supermatic Archive (Sep '03 - Jun '06)

Re: Supermatic spring breakage

Posted by Lloyd W Zornes on Monday, 05-Jun-2006

Old supermatic 2 has gone byby. Would like to purchase new Supermatic, please send price listings, phone number, and address. thank you.

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Re: Supermatic: Posted by Dave L on Tuesday, 06-Jun-2006
See: Retailers
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Posted by Rob on Wednesday, 24-May-2006

OMG!! I was making some Ramback Gold stuffed into Silver tip light tubes & IT HAPPENED; The return spring for the handle return to open broke! What to do? cut the spring another coil shorter & try to refit it? use my othe supermatic or supermatic II?
NO PROBLEM! TAKE THE SPRING OFF & CONTINUE! YOU DONT REALLY NEED THE SPRING! Just remember the first rule of supermaticism! DO NOT OVERSTUFF!!! If you close the tobacco chamber with a bunch of tobacco on top of cutter & the handle closes hard STOP & REVIEW the fundamentals & you wont have any problems caused by operator error.

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Re: Supermatic spring breakage

Posted by Warren on Wednesday, 24-May-2006

> YOU DONT REALLY NEED THE SPRING!

Yep, it works better without the spring. I also took the spring out from the Top-o-Matic and it works better without it as well. One should be careful for damage on the first few strokes after removing the spring, since it needs quite a bit less force to crank. Once the arm muscles adapt to the new feel, it works faster, uses less effort and it gives better control on the back-stroke (making it easier to slide the tube onto the nozzle for better packing).

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Re: Supermatic spring breakage: Posted by Kev on Friday, 26-May-2006
Funny you should mention the springs. While I use a Supermatic for the spouses 100mm smokes, I'm faster with an Excel for my own personal smokes. The return spring on my Excel broke several months ago and I find it much better without the spring too. I bought a replacement spring at the local hardware store but I never got around to installing after I realized I liked it without the spring.
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Why the big machines

Posted by Robert on Monday, 08-May-2006

Been doing syo for a while and won't smoke a premade anymore. I have a little blue 7 dollar machine that spits out perfect smokes everytime and can make a pack in 5-7 minutes. What is the purpose of the big expensive machines? I read the posts here about H-gear doowopers not working right, and cutters being gummed up, and the superjammer ultratetrahydroisoquinalin space gear assembly malfunctioning. Good God, I could maintain a British MGB (notoriously fun but infamously unreliable car) with less confusion. I'm not knocking the machines or their users here it's just that I don't get it. If someone would clearly articulate what the big payoff is I'd buy one. Do they make a carton of smokes in 20 minutes or something? Thanks for helping and smoke em' if you got em'.

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Re: Why the big machines

Posted by Bob on Tuesday, 09-May-2006

I can make a carton in about 1 hour, could probably do more if I hurried. I don't use a Supermatic, I use the Top-O-Matic, which so far (8-9 months), has not had any of the problems my Supermatic had.

With the small hand roller, I could make a pack in 20 minutes, 5-7 is just amazing.5 minutes would be more than a carton an hour.

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Re: Why the big machines: Posted by robert on Tuesday, 09-May-2006
Well ... I say 5 to 7 minutes... that's just a guess. I could time it and see. I also saw a post today about the guy who made a device to hold the big machine still so he could use both hands at once (versus holding it down himself) and is making almost 2 cartons in an hour. For a busy guy like myself that would be uber-helpful. I'll sit down and actually time a full pack and see. Hmmm - maybe I should invent a holder for the machine. Save some time. I'll let you know how fast I actually make a pack. If I do get a big machine I'm convinced from the posts here the top o matic is the way to go.
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Re: Why the big machines: Posted by Dano on Wednesday, 10-May-2006
I think the big machines are probably good for newbies to syo. I started with one. It lasted about a year until it shook itself apart. Worked well. Ultimately I realized that I didn't need a big machine with a big price tag to make a cheap little cigarette.

I've been using the little blue hand held for years now. There's no speed difference, I make a pack in about 5 mins. The only difference is the price tag. Beside that, the little hand held is going to last forever unless you step on it. No cleaning, no repairs, no oiling, no parts to play with. Just lock & load.
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Re: Why the big machines: Posted by Dave L on Thursday, 11-May-2006
For most folks the big machines are faster and easier to learn and use. For me the big plus is the convenience. I load up the hopper tray and make a pack of smokes. The handhelds don't come close to the simplicity and efficiency of motion. For me its worth the cost of occasionally cleaning the machine and not using overly moist tobacco.
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Re: Why the big machines-congrats: Posted by ROB on Friday, 26-May-2006
I did a YAHOO search for your word in posting I came upon as a NEW word for me (ultratetrahydroisoquinalin)
and gues what? it pointed right to YOUR POSTING!
GOOGLE has not caught the new yet!
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Re: Why the big machines

Posted by Angela on Sunday, 29-Oct-2006

I am going to buy one, because I am a little thing with not much strength and about 3 cigarettes into the blue thing my hand is killing me from packing the tobacco down. The big machines do that for you, my only problem with making my own. Just my opinion, and if I could pack them down I would not buy a bigger one, the small one is easier to find a place for I am sure.

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Re: Why the big machines: Posted by Matt on Sunday, 29-Oct-2006
Don't think you won't have to do a bit of packing with the big machines. It's all in the wrist though and requires no strength, just a bit of practice. (Throw it down and release your fingers.)
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Re: Why the big machines: Posted by Wazmo Nariz on Sunday, 29-Oct-2006
If you get yourself a few Smokey cases (or similar), you won't need to tamp the smokes down individually. Simply fill the cases with your sticks, leaving the tobacco sticking out the end of the sticks. Close the lid, invert the case and smack the whole case two or three good whacks, just like you'd do with a pack of premades. The excess tobacco will go into the tube quite nicely, and what doesn't will be knocked off and simply lay at the bottom of the case, ready to be dumped out and reused for your next batch.
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Supermatic "H" Linkage Problem

Posted by Ed Benson on Sunday, 07-May-2006

Guys/Gals,

I've got a Premier Supermatic and it has the "hiccup" in the middle of the

cranking operation that makes it real hard to crank through.

In looking at the bottom, I noticed the "H" linkage (see the picture at:

[link]

on mine is tilted like the picture shows, but the end where the red 2 --->

is, is pointed, not flat and at least an 1/8th of an inch from the wall.

If I push the side of the "H" opposite from the wall, and make the end hit

the wall, the "H" tilts a bit more, and the amount of the cutter showing

inside the nozzle is decreased and THEN the crank turns VERY smoothly.

The part of my cam (where the red 1 ---> is written on) is identical to the

picture and there dosen't appear to be any great wear and tear marks on

either the cam or the post. Also, both the cam and post are dull black ones.

My question is, what can I do to make the mid part of the "H" move toward

the wall of the machine so the cutter backs off just a bit and allows smooth

operation?

Thanks in advance for any help you can be.

Ed

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Posted by Dave L on Monday, 08-May-2006

The picture is of a Supermatic II which has a flatter end on the H linkage (#2). The "hiccup" you speak of is usually gunk buildup on the bottom of the cutter (or the top/front of the chamber). Have you taken the cutter out and cleaned it?

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Posted by Ed Benson on Tuesday, 09-May-2006

Dear Dave,

First, thanks for the reply. Between the time I wrote my post and now, I

had an idea that worked out great. First, let me say that the crank bushing

IS cracked into 2 pieces horizontally, but it taking a REAL hard look at the

action, that was not the problem.

I'll keep on the lookout for a new bushing of better material and replace it

in the future. With the bushing so screwed up, I didn't want to start ripping

the Premier apart and not get it back together again :-) and be TOTALLY

screwed.

What I ended up doing was to remove the "Universal Spoon" (Part Number

39) and then cranked the handle until the cam was at the side of the post.

This is the point at which the cutter is at its deepest and shows the most of

itself in the inside of the nozzle. I then got out my set of electric drill

bits and started inserting one after the other until I got to the one which

would not slide into the inside of the nozzle.

I put that one in my adjustable RPM electric drill and slowly drilled as far in

and out as the length of the drill bit would permit. I did that about 3 times

until there was barely any resistance.

I then took my can of compressed air and blew out all of the aluminum chips

and then re-inserted the "Universal Spoon".

I got out my "Stuffing Kit" and proceeded to make THEE most pleasent pack

of cigs I have ever done since getting my Ol' Big Blue. Since the "H"

Linkage still only tilted as far as it has in the past, and everything else

was working as THEY did in the past, the end results were identical as in

the past: A nicely packed, great tasting pack of ciggies. BUT, oh what a

PLEASURE it was to MAKE them!!!!!

I have a feeling if I had done this the FIRST time the "hiccup" in the middle of

the cranking operation reared its ugly head, my crank handle bushing would

STILL be in one piece! Ya lives and ya learns.

Ed

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Posted by PhlipCity on Tuesday, 09-May-2006

I'm not sure I understand what it is you're doing with this procedure. Are you increasing the size of the arc of the cutter itself? Perhaps you might post some pics for clarification.

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Re: Supermatic "H" Linkage Problem: Posted by PhlipCity on Tuesday, 09-May-2006
I don't appear to have a serious problem with my machine; I mean, I do notice that at the point where the post on the H linkage leaves the cam "groove" for the outer edge of the cam there is a slight "bump" or interuption of the smooth action, but I can't seem to understand how your solution would get around that. In looking through the nozzle of the thing, I can see a bit of the cutter but can't for the life of me see how drilling this out would do much good.

Maybe I'm not seeing things properly?
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Posted by Dave L on Wednesday, 10-May-2006

A broken bushing means excessive force has been used. The causes are too much tobacco, downward pressure on the crank handle and/or gunk buildup. The number one way to improve your machines performance is to take it apart and clean it (and replace that bushing). The compressed air was probably the best thing you did (it can blow out a lot of gunk).

If the drill bit pushed the cutter back as far as it could go (the H would be touching the sidewall, same as the pressure from the tobacco would do. If there's not too much gunk to prevent it, its the path of least resistance), you'd end up with a cutter face that is flush with the nozzle. If the slack wasn't taken up, or if there's future wear and tear, the cutter face could end up retracting beyond the nozzle. I prefer a bit of a safety margin because and overly retracted cutter face is really bad news (tobacco seriously hangs up on the way out).

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Re: Supermatic "H" Linkage Problem: Posted by PhlipCity on Wednesday, 10-May-2006
You know, once a week or so I take my Supermatic, remove the mat, run warm water forcefully through the tobacco chamber, around the cutter from underneath all the while working the thing back a forth a few times, then take a rag and wipe out the spoon guide area and tobacco chamber. Towel dry, blow out the rest with compressed air and voila! good as new.

About once every 5 or 6 months I field-strip the thing, buff up the cutter block and reassemble. I've never lubed it or anything like that (except to apply a drop or two of light sewing machine oil to the points that were originally lubed from the factory). Just 5 minutes maintenance once a week, half an hour or so every 5 or 6 months. Never had anything break, crack, or otherwise fail.
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Posted by Ed Benson on Wednesday, 10-May-2006

Guys,

OK, let's start from the top.

For PhlipCity:

1st: Even though the picture I used

[link]

is of the Supermatic II, my "H" is the same except for two

things. First, my cross bar at the the red 2 ---> is pointed,

not flat. The second is that when my cam is resting against

the post, like the red 1 --->, there is a gap of at least an

1/8th of an inch from the pointed end to the wall.

This positions the cutter the deepest it can go inside of the

nozzle. In looking at this picture:

[link]

you can see the curved part of the cutter making half of the

circle created so the tobacco can be stuffed. This part on

my Supermatic creates a too tight circle. Before I got out

my drill bits, I tried this: I removed the screw holding the

"Universal Spoon" and would move the crank 1/8th of a full

injection. I stuck a toothpick into the spoon's screw hole

and tried to push the spoon so that it came out of the nozzle,

like it had just stuffed a tube. Every 1/8th movement of the

crank had the spoon sliding out of the nozzle easily.

However, when the cam got to the point like it is at the red

1 ---> in the first picture, and the cutter is in as far as

the "H" permits, the spoon would not easily push through and

out the end of the nozzle. MY cutter made the circle so

tight, that to get the spoon to the "fully injected"

position, the spoon had to be pushed with force.

When I put in the 1st drill bit that wouldn't just drop into

the end of the nozzle, I had the bit that was just a hair

wider than the too tight circle created by my cutter. When

I honed out the "too tight circle" to a "just right circle",

the loose spoon shot through the nozzle like it had been

doing before my cutter was in its deepest position.

I hope this clarifies why the drill bit honing was necessary

to eliminate the hiccup.

For Dave Lers:

While I was honing out the cutter, I kept an eye on the "H"

and the crossbar never moved at all. The 1/8th inch gap

remained throughout all 3 in-out passes I made with the drill.

When I made that pack of cigs right after doing the honing,

for the first 5 or 6, I had the Premier upside down to

checkout the movement and through every full cranking

operation, my "H" pointed end did not move from that 1/8th

inch gap.

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Re: Supermatic "H" Linkage Problem: Posted by PhlipCity on Thursday, 11-May-2006
Thanks for the clarification. Apparently your machine was way further out of whack than mine or any I've ever seen, hence my confusion. ;-)

The large gap between the H linkage and wall is interesting; I was at my local shop earlier to get some supplies, and checked out three machines they have out for sale; none exhibited such a gap. But obviously quality control was not as tight as it could have been with the Supermatics in the past--at least from what I gather from many posts here.
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Re: Supermatic "H" Linkage Problem: Posted by Dave L on Thursday, 11-May-2006
What you've provided is an interesting cutter/spoon clearance solution. Its unlikely that that's really the issue. I've never seen an 1/8" gap or had a broken bushing and suspect they are related (I cannot think of anything else that might bend or otherwise cause that much gap). The most likely reason for the arm of the H not bumping into the machine wall under load is gunk buildup (the 1/8" gap could be contributing). You've got a broken and probably dirty machine. You won't know what's really going on until you take care of the basics.
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Posted by General maintenence tips on Saturday, 11-Mar-2006

I've probably made a hundred thousand cigs with my Supermatic. Here are some of the problems I've encountered:

1. The blue plastic bushing just below the crank has cracked twice. Symptom: Hard to crank the machine.
2. The h-link in the back has worn away to the point of being non-round. Symptom: Hard to crank the machine.
3. Unknown problem, suspect build up at the cutter plate. I'll let you know when I figure it out. Symptom: Hard to crank the machine.

I'm working with the Excel right now. It's flawless with the following exception:
1. Cutter blades snap off like there's no tomorrow. With the Excel, you must crank like the world's biggest wimp. I swear if you crank like a wimpy, you'll generate cartons without problems.

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I should clarify: Posted by Ralph on Saturday, 11-Mar-2006
What might be wimpy to me, might require your full strength on the crank (my wife for example). The important thing is follow through. It requires you to prevent follow through. Force on the follow through breaks the spoon over time, every time. It does nothing and doesn't enhance the final cig.
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Posted by Dave L on Sunday, 12-Mar-2006

I would guess that #3 was at least a contributing factor to #1 and 2, that 'hard to crank'/friction was the cause and not the symptom. Too much tobacco and/or tobacco buildup on the bottom of the cutter (see maintenance) are the #1 friction/stress factors by far.

In #2 I assume you mean the round post on the side of the 'H' linkage, the part that rides in the cam. What color is yours? The only posts/cams that I know to be made from hardened steel are the dull black ones.

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Re: Supermatic: Posted by Ralph on Friday, 24-Mar-2006
Yeah, I finally figured out how to work an Excel properly. It's been flawless now that I don't break spoons. I'm a bull in a china shop and I was thinking the follow through spat the cig out properly. Instead, it just breaks spoons. Since the Excel has been working flawlessly, I haven't put together the Supermatic again after I cleaned it. I assume it would work flawlessly. There was huge build up on the cutter.

You are right on the h-link. It's dull black but I made so many cigs with it, it wore down the roundness and it literally had a dimple on it. This was a killer for a smooth crank.
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Posted by Kima Fulton on Wednesday, 16-Nov-2005

Help! My boyfriend bough a $8 hand held about 3 months ago. I only like that for about a week. So I bought the $40 Supermatic Blue. It worked great!!! He and I rarely if ever bought name-brand cigs anymore. Now I have completely given up. I don't know how to take the thing apart or understand what you guys are talking about when you talk about bushings and such. Is there an easy step-by-step guide to taking apart and tweaking that even a girl could follow. Sometimes it will make a cigs but now it jams up about 4 out of 5 times. I would sit in the morning before work and make a days worth of cigs. Now I go to the store. Another issue. I am left handed and he is right - I have noticed that we turn the thing differently. I keep the tube thing straigt out in front of me and have to switch hands during the cranking process. Any suggestions for a lefty. Or on the jamming problem.

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Re: Supermatic: Posted by Denny on Wednesday, 16-Nov-2005
Yes I am also a lefty, but I use my right arm when cranking. Also you might want to try Dave's handle reversing trick, it worked for me. As for your jamming, it could be a number of things. I would suggest that you put the machine in a sink full of warm water. While its in there, work the mechanism back and forth let air dry, and DO NOT USE ANY TYPE OF OIL ON THE PARTS!!!!! I prefer to run the machine dry, as oil attracts the fine tobacco dust. Sometimes the loading spoon stud will loosen up, or dislodge itself. also make sure that all screws are tightened. Last make sure that the large nut is tightened on your lower crank shaft. As far as disassembly/reassembly, it is not that difficult to do, just take your time and use some common sense, you should have received a parts sheet with your super. Use this as a reassembly guide. I hope this helps.
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Posted by JD on Wednesday, 16-Nov-2005

Here's an excellent beginner's guide to PS maintenance that's located at another site (complete with pictures). Print it out, follow along and your problems should be solved.

[link]

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Posted by Kima on Thursday, 17-Nov-2005

Thanks for the link and the suggestions. I used to know where the little parts thing was - but I just bought a house and moved don't know where anything is. I don't want ya'll to think Boyfriend couldn't fix PS - but I have him re-wiring my house and hate to ask for anything else right now. haha!

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Re: Supermatic: Posted by Dave L on Thursday, 17-Nov-2005
You can get pdf schematics here.
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Re: Supermatic: Posted by Dave L on Thursday, 17-Nov-2005
What happens when you cycle the machine without tobacco? Is it tight/stiff or noisy at any point? Check that all screws/nuts/springs are in place and tight. Check the black plastic bushing (between the handle and the top of the machine) for cracks. Make sure the ring (on the underside of the machine) that holds it in place is tight. See the Supermatic Maintenance page for taking out the cutter and checking it for gunk buildup.
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Posted by Stephen on Thursday, 01-Sep-2005

Where can I get parts for my Premier Supermatic? This machine has saved met thousands of dollars over the years and given me much better tasting cigarettes. It is one off the best investments I ever made. I highly recommend it to any one looking to get into stuff your own. I hope someone knows where to get parts........ Thanks....

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Re: Supermatic Premier: Posted by MAJ on Thursday, 01-Sep-2005
Check out http://www.arbroinc.com for parts.
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Premier vs. Premier II

Posted by Sara on Monday, 22-Aug-2005

Hi, I've been using a hand held injector and have had good luck with it. My mother and I are thinking of buying a crank machine, but were wondering if you still have to pack the tobacco into the chamber or if the machine does it for you...That's our biggest issue with the hand held injectors (takes too much time to pack the tobacco to get a good firm cigarette). If anyone can answer my question, please email me.
Thanks.

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Re: Supermatic Premier: Posted by irishguyincc on Monday, 22-Aug-2005
The Supermatic will make packing your cigarettes a lot easier. With my handheld I had to pack tobacco into the slot with the lid three or four times before I could stuff the tube. With the Supermatic you have a big open hole that you put a bunch of tobacco in and then you just crank the handle. So it does compress the tobacco for you, you just have to fill the larger slot with some tobacco. It used to take me 2-3 minutes to make a cig with a handheld machine because of all the packing involved. With a Supermatic I can make a couple cigs a minute. A lot easier.
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Posted by Dave R on Thursday, 02-Jun-2005

Hi All:

Ok, I'm going to take the plunge and shelf my lil Gizeh and pickup a premier. As usual I've over investigated the pros and cons of all the desktop models and decided the premier series is the "best". (A small Part of my decision was because of this forum. Other manufacturers don't have a forum for trading tips and secrets!!. A big plus!!!)

One last question I have that I haven't been able to find a solid answer for is: Other than the premier making regular & 100's and the premier II only making Kings, What are the differences between them. Is there a quality difference? Is either one in danger of being discontinued? Are they both as easy to use as each other and do they make the same quality stick as each other?

Thanks.....I'll anxiously await your feedback before taking the plunge. I'm REALLY going to "frame" this lil Gizeh tho, I've used it for over a year with no problems!!! (I hope I didn't just jinx it!! :-(

Thanks again...
=Dave R=

PS: Feel free to email me direct if you have any suggestions and or preferences!!

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Re: Premier vs. Premier II

Posted by jazzbo on Monday, 10-Oct-2005

I'm sure you've already taken the plunge and purchased your Supermatic. I've been using mine for a little over a year now and can't complain too loudly.

The thing can be a little finicky concerning tobacco cut and moisture content, and I've not been able to go more than a carton or two without a teardown and cleaning, but it's gotten almost second nature and I can do it in about 10 minutes now (after lots of practice).

I've noted that, regardless of the claims, the Supermatic (at least mine) won't make a perfect 100mm stick--regardless. After tamping, I usually end up with a stick that's just ever-so-slightly larger than a king (tobacco-wise). That said, the old blue monster makes a king size better than any other machine I've ever used--and it packs well enough that a king will usually burn slower. I wouldn't mind trading up if they made a dedicated 100mm machine....

Welcome aboard, in any event.

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Re: Premier vs. Premier II: Posted by billy bob on Wednesday, 26-Jul-2006
i would buy the top a matic like i did i had nothing but trouble out of the supermatic ive rolled 30 cartons with my top o matic and no trouble at all ..
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Supermatic vs. Hand held lil ones

Posted by Dave R on Thursday, 05-May-2005

Hi all:

Great to see an NG about rolling your own and nice to see how many others are doing it as well. YEARS ago I rolled my own for cost. Now I'm rolling because I enjoy blending my own tobacco (and partially for cost!! :-). For the past 8-9 months I've been using one of those lil hand held plastic "Gizeh" gadgets and I am contemplating a Supermatic. Could anyone tell me if it makes any better of a quality cigarette? I enjoy the ones I'm making but the ends usually empty and it doesn't push the tobacco all the way to the filter so I end up having to "tamp" them all and twist the ends. Has this improved with the Supermatic or is it just less effort to use a desktop model with the quality staying the same. I'm probably going to buy one anyway but I was just curious so I don't get my hopes up TOO high :-). I don't make anything "odd" like 100's just the plain ol' kings.

Thanks for any "info" y'all can pass along. Feel free to email me directly in case I don't get back to read this NG before buying at administrator@grand-resorts.com

=Dave R.=

PS: If nothing else, It LOOKS like a slick machine !! I may get it JUST for the convenience.

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Re: Supermatic vs. Hand held lil ones

Posted by Runs with Scissors on Thursday, 05-May-2005

I think you will like the Supermatic so well that you will retire your Gizeh to travel use only.
I make 100's so I can't testify first hand about the quality of King Size cigarettes produced by the Supermatic.
But I have read in several posts that the Supermatic slightly understuffs the 100's and slightly overstuffs the Kings. What I mean is my 100's are filled to the tip but when I tap the filters to finalize the packing of the tube, I end up with a 1/8" gap between the tip and the tobacco. If the Kings are overstuffed, you likely will end up with a completely filled tube after tapping the filter end.
You will go through a learning curve at first with your Supermatic-we all did. They are robust machines, but sensitive to overly moist, dry or overstuffed loads.
You likely will adjust by the time you stuff your first two packs.
I learned these things by trial and error.
Recently, I discovered a wealth of information about Supermatics in videos found here.
< http://www.ryomagazine.com/multimedia/ >
I suggest you watch them so you will be ahead of the game by the time your machine arrives.
Whatever you do, please post your impressions about the Supermatic after you use it for awhile. Almost everything I've read is positive.

Bill

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Re: Supermatic vs. Hand held lil ones: Posted by Kev on Thursday, 05-May-2005
Well, my king/100 selector broke at the rivet a long time ago so I just stuff 100's with the Supermatic. It tends to leave the 100's slightly under-stuffed but that may be related to the broken part. Then again, since the tray is the same size whether you stuff 100's or kings, I could easily see how it would over-stuff a king and under-stuff a 100.

I used one of those little hand held injectors for just a few weeks when I started stuffing. I recall over/under-stuffing often on the hand held injector. I would think any Premier/Excel machine would be a great improvement. I switched to kings about 6 weeks ago for various reasons and I'm using the less expensive Excel machine. It works great though I'm sure it won't last a long time due to the majority of it being plastic. Over stuffing on a Premier or Excel will cause problems over time
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Electric Supermatic Premier

Posted by Ralph on Saturday, 09-Apr-2005

I first read about SYO on a blog. I went to the local smoke shop and was about to buy a couple pounds of tobacco, tubes and a small injector. A wise old lady stopped from buying the little injector and told me to get something bigger. She recommended the Excel. After about 5 cartons, I bent the spoon on it and went to the smoke shop and purchased the Supermatic. I don't see how you can compare the two. The Excel is a toy compared to the Supermatic. I had all the bugs everbody has noted when I first pulled it out of the box but after oiling and tweaking some screws, the thing has been incredible and seems to perform better with time. Both my wife and I are heavy smokers and I'm stuffing for two. I have trained her to make them in a pinch but she's not interested in taking on added cigarette making duty.

I smoke kings and the thing overstuffs as noted below. Just don't fill the far right of the chamber as someone noted. I personally prefer an overstuffed cigarette as opposed to an understuffed one. If there's too much tobacco on the end, I pinch it off. Normally I just pack the extra tobacco into the end of the cigarette with my thumb.

After extensive use and too many cigarettes made from tobacco powder, the bushing has broke on it. I had previously purchased replacement spoons for the Excel so I have pressed that machine back into use. The difference is like night and day. The biggest drawback on the Excel is getting the tube on it. Recessing the tube connector into the machine was a bad decision. My crimping rate on tubes for the Supermatic is zero. On the Excel, I have problems placing the empty paper tube on the machine about one in five. Of course, the paper tub crimps and I have to go back and smooth out the tube in order to try again. This cuts down on production rates severely. In order to fix this problem, I find myself craning my neck to look into the hole as I place the paper tube on the connector. I can't figure out why they didn't expose it like the Supermatic. That said, for the price, it is a darn good machine.

I intend to order a new bushing for the Supermatic on Monday. In the interim, I have glued the old bushing back together and I'm going to attempt to reassemble the thing. Does anyone have any tips on reassembling a Supermatic? Rather than trial and error it, if anyone can tell me what position the machine should be in (opened or closed) or any other tips, I stand a better chance of getting the thing working with the glued bushing.

This is a great site and I thank the hosts. SYO is a great thing and I'd tell more people about it but my concerns are that the government is going to crack down. For this reason I have been very judicious about spreading the word on this. Sorta sad. I suspect it will only be a matter of time before the governments recognizes the lost tax revenues as this practice becomes more widespread and they'll come down hard. Oh well. At any rate, thanks again for the great site.

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Re: Supermatic Premier: Posted by David on Saturday, 07-May-2005
I have been making cigs for two (funny my other half doesnt want to add cig making to her repitoire either)with a supermatic11 for about 18mths. I have had the casing around the bush crack and liftup. No problem I just popriveted a small square of stainless steel around the bush housing and presto - better than new. I have tried quite a few machines over the years The supermatic11 is definatley the best

RDs David
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Posted by Kev on Sunday, 27-Feb-2005

Check out Detroit Tobacco's website. They've got a motorized version of the Supermatic for $300. Basically, the hand crank is removed and a motor was installed. I've learned by "feel" of the crank whether my Supermatic has too much/little tobacco. Anyone feeling adventurous?

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Re: Electric Supermatic Premier

Posted by jake on Sunday, 27-Feb-2005

For that kind of money I'd buy a Dunhill lighter, a sterling silver cigarette case, a set of precious metal cufflinks and a brand new Premier Supermatic® machine.
Bet you that all could be bought on eBay for about the same price.

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Re: Electric Supermatic Premier: Posted by jake on Friday, 04-Mar-2005
I have perhaps overstated my case. The cuff links? Fuggedaboutdem!
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Supermatic Premier Tips I'd like to share

Posted by Shannon on Tuesday, 11-Jan-2005

I expose about 1/8" of the cutter before adding tobbacco to the chamber. I then evenly pack tobbacco into the length of the chamber making sure none of it protrudes above the cutter. Using this method I always have smooth spoon operation, avoid jams caused by overpacking the chamber and reduce cutter residue. I've had success using this method with all consistencies of tobbacco including bottom of the bag shake. Some tools I keep on my rolling tray are a wooden chopstick for chamber maintenance, as well as a keychain size credit card and soft bristle toothbrush used to remove cutter residue and tobbacco dust.

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Re: Supermatic Premier Tips I'd like to share: Posted by Mart on Friday, 29-Jul-2005
Thank you for this tip... it really helped me stop over packing the chamber in my Supermatic II.
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Re: Supermatic Premier Tips I'd like to share: Posted by JD on Monday, 24-Oct-2005
A great tip, and one I've incorporated recently after reading your post.

One other thing I'd like to mention is that the moisture content of your tobacco WILL play a huge part in your successes (and failures). I've been using a Premier Supermatic for about two and a half months now, and like everyone else was slightly disappointed in the performance...until I visited a friend who had been using one for about a year. He taught me the proper "feel" of tobacco which is at the proper moisture level (slightly crispy but not crunchy) and I've since had an easier time of stuffing--with almost any cut of tobacco (except D&R Athey of course!). Far fewer rejects and almost no clogs, stiff action, filter-end voids, etc.

Any newbies to MYO out there (like myself)--don't give up, follow the great advise you can get here and at RYO magazine and you'll never look back.

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Re: Supermatic Hopper

Posted by Jennifer on Friday, 12-Nov-2004

I found this while doing a google search for 'clinton tube company'

Clinton's Nifty 50th

Clinton Tubes' Premier Supermatic commemorates its 50th birthday this year. To celebrate, the company plans to debut a Supermatic Hopper tobacco feed system that will give smokers the ability to load tobacco once and produce 1 to 30 cigarettes. Clinton Tube (CTC), Montreal, Canada, 514-321-8155.
http://www.tobonline.com/ArticlePages/ArticlePagesVol63/vol63p72.htm

Maby someone at CTC found this website and got an idea. Its nice to see a company that keeps improving on an already great product.

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Posted by Dave L on Saturday, 13-Nov-2004

That's from May/June 2003. There was also a preview/picture in the Winter 2003 issue of RYO Magazine (http://www.ryomagazine.com/winter2003/injectors.htm).

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Re: Supermatic Hopper: Posted by Hey Pocky Way on Sunday, 14-Nov-2004
So when are they going to come out with this? It seems like a pretty simple add on.
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Re: Supermatic Hopper

Posted by Jennifer on Monday, 22-Nov-2004

That vertical hopper looks to be a bit to tall. The tray I use for my supermatic (like the ones dave makes) works great. I am not sure if I would want one of the CTC hoppers. Sometimes I overpack the machine and have to pry out the tobacco. It seems to me that having to remove the hopper every time that happines would be a pain. I had actualy thought of making a virtical hopper befor. If the CTC hopper is cheap enough and works on the supermatic 2 I might pick one up. But I can make a pack quick enough with the hopper tray I use.

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Re: Supermatic Hopper: Posted by E. D.Gravitt on Thursday, 06-Jan-2005
I'm curious about your "tray" , can you tell us more about it? Thank you , respectfully E.D.Gravitt
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One year, plus.

Posted by Tim Aydt on Monday, 25-Oct-2004

After a year, I am still extremely pleased with my Premier Supermatic. After a little estimating, it seems that I've made more than 25,000 cigarettes on it. Recently, the spring for the spoon return failed, both hooks broke off. I used the one off my vintage Premier and will try to find a replacement at Lowe's. I expect to have to replace the cutter soon. It's getting very worn. Does anyone have an opinion on having one made out of steel?

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Re: One year, plus.: Posted by Kurt Wall on Tuesday, 26-Oct-2004
I'm no craftsman, but it seems to me that a steel cutter would keep an edge longer and wouldn't wear quickly. On the spare parts, can you order them directly from CTC?

K
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Re: One year, plus.

Posted by Terry Ash on Thursday, 03-Mar-2005

You can buy replacement parts for the Supermatic at www.jackgee.com. The website will direct you to their phone number (518) 834-3038 and tells you that you should ask for the parts department.

I am in no way affiliated with them, I have just needed replacement parts in the past as well.

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Re: One year, plus.: Posted by Dave L on Thursday, 03-Mar-2005
That's Arbro's (http://www.arbroinc.com/) number. Arbro is the US service center for CTC machines.
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Re: One year, plus.

Posted by Dan on Wednesday, 09-Mar-2005

Tim,
I beleive the cutter is made out of softer metal so that it will wear down (you are able to replace it) and not the other parts around it. I would not make one out of steel....just stick to brass or aluminum or whatever your model is made of. Steel might cause too much wear on the other bits and parts.

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Re: One year, plus.: Posted by Dave L on Saturday, 12-Mar-2005
I agree. There's also the matter of economics. If a custom cutter costs you less than ten stock cutters, I want the number of your machinist :).
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Re: Supermatic Premier-VIDEO

Posted by Roger on Tuesday, 17-Aug-2004

For the newbies here catch this video of a supermatic in action, you'll be faster after an hour than the video!
Also check Doug's RYOmagazine http://www.ryomagazine.com/
for upcoming videos on everything concerning the MYO/RYO world-untill then heres the videos I'am aware of operating at this time.
http://www.customblends.com/

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Re: Supermatic Premier-VIDEO: Posted by Wood on Tuesday, 17-Aug-2004
Posted a negative coment re: the Supermatic. Bought it from ebay.
After lubricating it and using it a few times, I can appreciate the rave reviews. Truly a superior machine.
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Re: Supermatic Premier: Posted by Dave S on Friday, 21-May-2004
I started with an excel stuffer. The excel machine worked well at first but after a few weeks started leaving an air gap at the filter end. I almost went back to pre mades. A local tobacco store had a brand new blue Supermatic with a box of tubes and cigarette box for $29.99. The best purchase I ever made. I have had nothing but good luck with this machine. Even at $45 bucks I would recommend this unit over any other type. If I could just get the local tobacco store to carry better tobacco than Peoples Pride, zig-zag ect.
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A note about the tube length setting.: Posted by Tim Aydt on Friday, 23-Apr-2004
I just commented on this in another post, but felt it needed to be here also.

On the Premier Supermatic, the label doesn't match where the settings actually are at. Start with the little handle all the way to the left, as far as it will go, and that is 100mm. Lift it up and move it one click to the right and you have King Size, on mine this is between 100mm and King Size on the label. One more click to the right and you will find the Regular setting, which is directly under the King Size on the label. Everything else to the right is wasted space, you will notice it doesn't lock in anywhere.
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Premier Supermatic

Posted by Kurt Wall on Thursday, 18-Mar-2004

I just received my Premier Supermatic. I love this machine! I thought I was doing okay with the little plastic injector I bought with a Zig Zag starter kit, but this machine is terrific. It's much faster and makes a consistent cigarette.

I'm still calibrating my fingers to the right amount of tobacco to put in the slot, though. Any tips? Should I just sprinkle the tobacco in loosely and let the top of cutter do all the work or lightly tamp the tobacco in to pack it slightly first?

For those interested, I was able to find my Supermatic for $40 on eBay. It was a new kit, coming with 200 Premier king size tubes and a little plastic cigarette case.

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Re: Premier Supermatic

Posted by Joe on Saturday, 24-Apr-2004

You will be very disappointed in a very short period of time with the Supermatic. There is a very serious design flaw in it that does not show up until you use it for a few weeks. The Excel is the best machine available at this time.

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Re: Premier Supermatic

Posted by Kurt Wall on Saturday, 24-Apr-2004

Namely? I've used it consistently and steadily for about 6 weeks now and, so far, have no complaints. To what are you referring?

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Re: Premier Supermatic: Posted by Jim on Monday, 25-Oct-2004
I've been using the Premier Supermatic for almost three years now and the only malfunction I've ever had was a broken bushing from forcing the level and a broken return spring. I fixed those things myself. I routinely stuff about three cartons of smokes a week (for two people) and I have no complaint at all with the machines.
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Re: Design Flaw?: Posted by Tim Aydt on Saturday, 24-Apr-2004
So, don't leave us hanging Joe. What, exactly is this design flaw?

As you can see, I've chronicled the problems I had with my Premier in the beginning and how CTC made the problems go away. Sure, it's a cantankerous machine; you can't overstuff, or use too moist of tobacco, but mine is eight months old. I haven't cleaned it since around Christmas, it's made over 10,000 cigarettes, and that comes to a saving of $1500.00 or more over pre-mades. If it disintegrated tomorrow, I would purchase a new one before the day was out.

I'm sorry if I sound like a rep for CTC, but in this day and age, it is rare to find a company with as courteous and quick customer service as they have. That buys my loyalty to them and the Premier Supermatic. When you come on here and make a blanket statement condemning one of the most reliable appliances I own, and without the least bit of explanation. I have to wonder if you really know what you are talking about.

What problems did you encounter? Is it possible that you may have overstuffed it with tobacco? Or, used too moist of tobacco? Did you contact CTC? Did you really give it a chance?

I'm sorry, Joe, if this message seems like I'm flaming you, that is not my intent, but come on, throw us a bone here before you lambaste a product that faithfully performs it's purpose, day in and day out, for so many of us.
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Re: Premier Supermatic: Posted by Roger on Thursday, 27-May-2004
What is this "There is a very serious design flaw in it that does not show up until you use it for a few weeks." you speak of???????????????
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Re: Premier Supermatic: Posted by Wood on Saturday, 14-Aug-2004
I agree with you. I find the Supermatic awkward,stiff, and loud.
The Excel is a superior machine in every way.
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Re: Premier Supermatic: Posted by Jennifer on Tuesday, 28-Sep-2004
I would say the only seriouse flaw in the supermatic is the user. I own a supermatic 2 and it works GREAT. Any probs I had with it were fixed by adjusting the tube release and flipping the crank plate. If you properly adjust the machine and know how to use it and care for it, you wont have maby problems with it. With such high quality stuffers out there. I am surprised anyone would still want to use a plastic injector.
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Re: Supermatic Premier: Posted by Kevin on Friday, 09-Jan-2004
I just recently purchased a Supermatic. After reading alot about HOW to properly use it and being careful, it seemed to hang. After a pack, the rivet in the tobacco tray broke. Rather than return it, I decided to disassemble and improve on their design. Sharpened the blades and adjusted the final cutter clamp. Works like a charm now even though I have a fixed 100mm setting due to my modifications. Even with dry tobacco, I've got to scrape the build up off the top part of the cutter about every 2 packs or else it will hang. It takes about a carton of use to really get the hang of using it but it's fast. It could really use some type of tobacco holding/overflow tray since any "extra" tends to slide off the side.
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Re: Re: Supermatic Premier

Posted by Tim Aydt on Friday, 26-Sep-2003

I, too, had problems with a poorly crimped spoon. Out of the box, it hung on the return ever time. I immediately called CTC and since it was in the evening I left a message on their voice mail. I received a callback before noon the next day. I spoke to Dan Colvin, who was concerned and helpful. I explained what was wrong and also expressed concern that the cutter might not might not fit as tightly into the slot as it should. Some moist tobacco was really caking up the bottom of the cutter and it seemed like more was getting under there than it should. Dan offered to ship out a new spoon that day and to let him know if I had any more problems with the cutter, or anything else, and they would take care of it. I got the impression that he would have shipped out a new cutter if I had asked.

Two days later I had my new spoon, free of charge, and was making cigarettes hassle free. I've noticed that dryer tobaccos do not cake on the cutter as badly. I did feel the the blades on the cutter were kind of dull. I sharpened them by wrapping a piece of Emery cloth around a screwdriver, that was the right diameter, and with a few strokes it had a fine edge on it.

I disassemble and clean my machine every 300-400 cigarettes, or when ever the action starts to feel really sluggish. My friend that got me started in SYO has never cleaned his machine in the 3 or 4 months he has had it and the action on it is smoother that mine. I suspect that CTC is still having some quality control issues, but they seem more than willing to take care of any problems.

Let me just say, that when I tried SYO five years ago, I quit for a number of reasons, mainly because I was dissatisfied with the hand-held injector that I was using at that time. The Premier Supermatic, and a little education, makes making cigarettes quick and easy. I would not be doing SYO without it.

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Posted by Mike on Saturday, 10-Jan-2004

I have been using my Premier for almost 3yrs now. About once every 2 months I will completely disassemble it, clean and lube as needed. I did have to replace the spoon after around 9 months, but that was due to my own misuse. I also have an Excel. Both work extremely well and I too, would not be making my own with out them. Good maintenance is important to any mechanical device. I am looking forward to Premier releasing the "hopper" for the Supermatic to speed up the process even more!!

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the hopper?

Posted by Tim Mc. on Friday, 06-Feb-2004

The Hopper aye? Suh-weet! Where can I find some information on that little miracle-waiting-to-happen?

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Re: the hopper?: Posted by Dave L on Tuesday, 10-Feb-2004
I'm real curious how well it will be able to handle all the variations in cuts/moisture content. It seems to me you really need finger feedback to get the right amount of tobacco evenly stuffed into the slot. It also looks awkward to hold on to. (http://www.ryomagazine.com/winter2003/injectors.htm).
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My Supermatic

Posted by Tim Aydt on Saturday, 10-Jan-2004

After three and a half months of hard use, my supermatic is working better than ever. It seems that there is a break-in period, or at least there was for mine. It took about ninety days, but now I rarely have to clean and oil it.

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Cleaning: Posted by Tim Aydt on Monday, 10-May-2004
It started getting sluggish so I cleaned it over the weekend, first time in over five months. Everything looks brand new, accept the cutter.

It is a little worse for wear, dull, with dents on the cutting edges. I wish it was made out of something tougher than aluminum. I'm thinking about going to a machine shop and having them make a new one out of brass or steel.

Even in as bad shape as it was, with a good cleaning and quick sharpening, used a nail file, it works great.
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Posted by Bill S. on Monday, 09-Aug-2004

Firstly, I have two Premier Supermatic Machines. One is the "vintage" machine with the Brass Cutter, etc. The front lever adjustment says from L to R, "plain-end", "king-size" and "regular-size." This is one of those burgandy-red machines. This thing will make king-filters all day long without a problem. I wanted to make 100mm filter cigarettes so I bought the newer version of the same machine which is the new Blue model which has an aluminum cutter and says behind the adjustment lever on front L to R, "100mm", "king-size-filter" and "regular-size-filter."

Now for the problem; both machines will not make a very good 100mm cigarette. I have no problem whatsoever with filter end gap. Both machines have been adjusted as per the directions in one of these letters where you set the machine to mid-position and use a "king-size-filter"-tube which is empty to set the machine up to release the moment that the spoon lightly contacts the filter in the tube. In the most left position, both machines have been tested and make the same contact in using the empty 100mm tube. The problem is that the spoon seems too short in both machines. Like I said before, I have no problem with filter-end gap, but I can't get these machines to fill the tubes all of the way out to the end of the cigarette.

To make matters worse, I have tried various filling volumes with seems to help some, but usually I end up with a "king-size" volume cigarette in a 100mm tube which means that I have between 9/16" to 3/8" gap at the end of the cigarette where it is just empty paper. By the time you tap these cigarettes on the filter end to "set" the tobacco, you don't have a much longer cigarette than a king-size-filter length.

Worse yet, I have measured the entire length of both machines' spoons and they are IDENTICAL in length. Now I am really confused because I was told that the new Supermatic had a larger chamber and a longer spoon in order to make these 100mm cigarettes. Now I have two machines that appear identical except the construction on the Vintage machine is a little better and it seems to make a little fuller 100mm cigarette than the new machine that was designed to make them.

Has anyone out there ever encountered this same problem? I am somewhat confused that the machines would have the same length spoon which appears to be too-short and the chambers appear volumetrically the same? When I do the "empty-100mm-tube-test" on each machine, both act the same. I think the problem is that when the spoon tip contacts the filter on the tube, the spoon is extended all of the way out. The final 3/8" to 1/2" of the spoon cannot carry any tobacco because it is solid and not hollow spoon like the rest of the spoon.

When I looked on the CTC parts list they show that the red-burgandy machine should have a different part no. than the blue newer Supermatic. Closer examination of these show that the real difference is that the newer spoon has a crimped spoon around a plastic plug, and the old one is made and machined to the metal pull-rod. Any Ideas will be appreciated. I have been into the MYO process for about a year, and have always liked it except for I have always preferred the 100mm cigarettes. It is unbelieveable that my small plastic Zig-Zag portable can fill these tubes better than one of these table-top machines but when I measured it;it is the same length as the Supermatics, but with the area "all-usuable." WHAT GIVES?

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